Subject: SC 22 N 3240 - SC 22/WG 11 Response to SC 22 N 3213, Liaison Stat ement from ITU-T SG 7 Regarding ISO/IEC 11404

From: Matthew Deane <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 31 May 2001 11:59:21 -0400

ISO/IEC JTC 1/SC22
Programming languages, their environments and system software interfaces
Secretariat:  U.S.A.  (ANSI)
 
ISO/IEC JTC 1/SC22 N 3240
 
TITLE:
SC 22/WG 11 Response to SC 22 N 3213, Liaison Statement from ITU-T SG 7
Regarding ISO/IEC 11404

DATE ASSIGNED:
2001-05-31
 
SOURCE:
SC 22/WG 11 Convener (W. Wakker)

BACKWARD POINTER:
N/A
 
DOCUMENT TYPE:
Other document (Defined)

PROJECT NUMBER:
22.17
 
STATUS:
The SC 22/WG 11 response has been forwarded to ITU-T SG 7.
 
ACTION IDENTIFIER:
FYI
 
DUE DATE:
  
DISTRIBUTION:
Text

CROSS REFERENCE:
 
DISTRIBUTION FORM:
Def
 
Address reply to:
ISO/IEC JTC 1/SC22 Secretariat
Matt Deane
ANSI
25 West 43rd Street
New York, NY  10036
Telephone:  (212) 642-4992
Fax:             (212) 840-2298
Email:  [email-masked]

_______ end of title page; beginning of text ______________

ISO/IEC JTC1/SC22/WG11 N 475

Dear Olivier Dubuisson:

The following is in response to your liaison statement regarding ISO/IEC
11404 and its revision.

1.  At the JTC1/SC22/WG11 meeting of 2001-04-27 / 2001-04-28 in Copenhagen,
your liaison statement was discussed and I hope that this letter satisfies
your concerns.

2.  We will update the normative references, as you have suggested.

3.  Regarding harmonization of ASN.1 and ISO/IEC 11404, we are very
ethusiastic about maintaining harmony among both documents, including,
possibly, an annex on ASN.1 in the 11404 revision.  Our intent is to use
the existing data type models from ASN.1 and other ISO/IEC standards in
revising ISO/IEC 11404 to capture and distinguish the datatype notions that
are now in common use.  We look forward to working with you to clarify our
understanding of the ASN.1 data types, including any emerging work, and to
get consistent definitions where appropriate.

4.  We note that the scope of ASN.1 is much wider than that of ISO 11404,
but not so intensive with respect to distinction and characterization of
datatypes.  Because of its association with programming languages, a major
objective of ISO/IEC 11404 is to distinguish types by their computational
characteristics, not just their values, which is the extent of the ASN.1
characterization.  We see these two standards as having a large overlap in
the identification of datatypes, but complementary roles with respect to
definition and representation of datatypes.

For example, both ISO/IEC 8824-1 and ISO/IEC 11404 define the Integer
datatype in terms of the values in the space.  But ISO/IEC 11404 goes on to
characterize the Integer type as having addition, multiplication and
ordering, and requires a type definition to say whether it preserves those
operations, because that is important when mapping the new type into a
programming language.  So a credit card number is not an Integer in ISO/IEC
11404, although it could be represented by an Integer in ISO/IEC 8824-1.

5.  We are looking forward to a successful collaboration with ITU-T
regarding ASN.1 and the revision of ISO/IEC 11404.  We consider this a
continuation of earlier joint work that caused ISO/IEC 11404:1996 to
contain several concepts derived directly from ISO 8824-1:1994.

Sincerely,
Frank Farance
Project Editor for ISO/IEC 11404 revision
US International Representative (NCITS/L8) to SC22/WG11

---------------------------------------------------------
[Original liaison statement.]

TO:	ISO/IEC JTC 1/SC 22
FOR:	Action

CONTACT: Olivier Dubuisson
France Télécom R&D

Tel: +33 2 96 05 38 50
Fax: +33 2 96 05 39 45
Email: [email-masked]

The ASN.1 Group would like to inform you about the planned withdrawal of
the obsolete ISO/IEC 8824:1990 which is referenced in the "Normative
References" section of  ISO/IEC 11404.  The ISO/IEC 8824:1990 standard was
made obsolete in 1994 with the publication of ISO/IEC 8824-1 which corrects
many problems that existed in the 1990 version of the standard.  The
current version of the standard is ISO/IEC 8824-1:1997.  Please update
ISO/IEC 11404 to refer to the current version of the ASN.1 standard which
is:

        ITU-T Recommendation X.680 (1997) | ISO/IEC 8824-1:1998,
Information technology - Abstract Syntax Notation One (ASN.1):
Specification of basic notation.

Please also note that one of the main purposes of ASN.1 is to provide a
language for describing data which is independent of the machine
architecture and independent of programming language.  A description of
data written in ASN.1 can translate easily to any high-level language and
(for example) result in a C structure, a C++ class, a Java class, a Pascal
record, or a Cobol copy file.  This allows a protocol writer to create a
specification which is independent of machine architecture and programming
language while allowing software developers to choose which ever language
and machine architecture best suits their needs.  Indeed, when using any of
the encoding rules defined in ISO/IEC 8825-1 or 8825-2, a communicating
node does not need any knowledge of which programming language or machine
architecture is in use by any of the communicating peers.

The ASN.1 group is willing to assist you with updating the ISO/IEC 11404
standard to take advantage of the strength of ASN.1 in describing data with
notation that is independent of programming language or machine
architecture.

More information on ASN.1, including free books and free download of tools,
can be found at http://asn1.elibel.tm.fr or http://www.oss.com.

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